occasionally a book comes across my desk at work that grabs my attention. this one left me without an appetite:
Tens of thousands of women in India die each year, mostly soaked in kerosene by their husbands or in-laws and then set alight. Those who survive live with hideous scars. Commonly referred to as “victims of dowry deaths”, they have become statistics. So have the tens of thousands of girl babies killed each year, often by their own mothers, simply because they were not boys. Considered a lifelong burden, their lives are easily snuffed at birth or soon afterwards, and the authorities rarely intervene. Among the middle classes, female infanticide has also become increasingly common in the form of abortions, following scans that detect the sex of the unborn child. That too has become big business in towns and cities, with unscrupulous doctors making vast fortunes. It is a complete cycle of violence and oppression — from birth to death — and women themselves seem to have helped perpetuate this practice in the name of religion and tradition. Many have seen their own lives as not worth living, and have tried to spare their daughters from a similar fate.
i’m speechless. and nauseated. social justice is a big theme on our seminary campus, and is growing in importance for Drew and I.
but what in the WORLD can we do when things like this happen in the name of religion?
what can we do if they think its ok?
what about those that don’t like it, don’t want, but can’t stop it?
quote taken from: Death by Fire: Sati, Dowry Death, adn Female Infanticide in Modern India, by Mala Sen, Rutgers University Press, 2002.
35 responses so far ↓
HW // April 29, 2008 at 2:29 pm
It is easy to pretend these things don’t happen… and devestating to learn that they do.
We adopted one of our daughters from Ethiopia, and it was eye-opening to learn about a culture where fgm (female mutilation) still occurs, and then to see the devastating poverty first hand when I went to bring her home.
I don’t have any answers… just all of the same questions.
alece // April 29, 2008 at 3:06 pm
it’s heart-wrenching to discover (and really think about) what goes on around the world today. not quite to that extreme, but we experience some things in africa that similarly break my heart: female circumcisions, “muti killings” (where someone is killed so that body parts can be “harvested” for witchdoctors to use in curses…), etc.
i just shake my head.
how do we change it? i don’t totally have the answer. it sounds cliche to say “jesus is the answer” — we know He is, but what does that mean? what does that look like?
something is brewing. i can feel it.
Joe Louthan // April 29, 2008 at 3:32 pm
Alece: I have that same feeling.
Like the bottom is about to fall out.
mandythompson // April 29, 2008 at 4:54 pm
Heidi: wow.
Alece & Joe: maybe Jesus will get back down here SOON & straighten ALL of us out… man. can you imagine?! its time for a change in this world.
edfromct // April 29, 2008 at 5:02 pm
My guess is that “dowry deaths” and witchcraft are traditional ways of dealing with a problem. The people who practice these traditions don’t think about whether it is right or wrong they just use these methods because that it as the way it has always been done. It is simply accepted, not questioned.
To change these practices the people in these societies need to be shown a better way to handle problems. People will turn away from witchcraft when modern medicine is introduced and does a better job of curing illness than the local witch doctor can.
The only way to eliminate dowry deaths is to eliminate the dowry system of marriage. Getting people to change their traditions is a very difficult. My hope is that the young people of India will look at the marriage practices of other cultures and eventually adopt practices that they can see work better.
The Indian government is trying to address the problem. The law referenced below needs to be ratified and enforced in all the 28 states of India. At least some enforcement is taking place. Per Wikidedia:
“The Protection of Women from Domestic Violence Act 2005 was brought into force by the Indian government from October 26, 2006. The Act was passed by the Parliament in August 2005 and assented to by the President on 13th September, 2005. As of November 2007, it has been ratified by four of twenty-eight state governments in India; namely Andhra Pradesh, Tamil Nadu, Uttar Pradesh and Orissa. Of about 8,000 criminal cases registered all over India under this act, Rajasthan had 3440 cases, Kerala had 1,028 cases, while Punjab had 172 cases registered”
alece // April 29, 2008 at 5:03 pm
mmmm… as much as that would be great, i’m thinking that WE are supposed to BE the change (DO the change, CATALYST the change). i have the sense that His return is still a long ways off. “all nations will hear AND THEN the end will come” — we’re nowhere near that.
mandythompson // April 29, 2008 at 5:05 pm
Ed:
the author of the book mentioned work that the Indian government is doing to stop this ritual… but she noted that, because it is a “religious” privilege for these women, laws won’t really change the situation. a lot of them ARE forced to burn, but some of them actually choose it. wow. WHAT a different view system they have. really.
i agree with you that an alternative has to be in place, otherwise the culture will perpetuate itself. totally agree.
mandythompson // April 29, 2008 at 5:13 pm
Al:
how can we offer an alternative to people who might not even want a change? what do we do when people don’t want to be different/better/improved?
its the oldest problem in the counseling book, and can be applied sociologically/anthropologically as well…
how do we effect change in a culture that might not want change?
they must want it.
yes, we have to show them their broken before they will seek healing.
but, how do we explain it as brokenness when they think the brokenness is what is fixing them???
am i being too philosophical?
i think i just gave myself a headache.
edfromct // April 29, 2008 at 5:29 pm
Alece, when looking at the information on your “Thrive Africa” site what jumps out at me is “88% are unemployed and 75% experience chronic hunger.”
I can’t imagine how hard it must be to bring hope to people living in these conditions. I would think that as long as the different tribes of South Africa think of themselves only in terms of their own tribe than the resources will only go to those tribes that have political power. The smaller, weaker tribes will be ignored by the government.
You are doing your part. You are acting as a catalyst for change. What you have begun will help to provide the spark that can bring a culture of hope to the Basotho people. With hope will come change.
alece // April 29, 2008 at 5:31 pm
no i totally understand. we often say that one of the hardest things in ministry is that we often want change for people more than they want it for themselves. and then nothing happens. nothing CAN happen until people want it and choose it.
so you’re right - the question is really how do we make people want something they have been ingrained not to want?
i just felt hopelessness creep over my shoulders like a blanket.
alece // April 29, 2008 at 5:33 pm
ed… thanks for your kind words. you’re right that the smaller, weaker tribes get ignored by the tribe in power in government. it’s unfortunate…
“with hope will come change”. indeed!
edfromct // April 29, 2008 at 5:55 pm
Mandy, as long as people have no exposure outside their own cultural that will accept what they are told by their leaders. They will follow their old traditions because this is the only way they know.
I have hope because I see more intra(?) cultural exchanges between the people in the world. The Internet, TV, International trade, are bringing the world to all these isolated communities. When a young girl in India learns about young American girls, who go to school, get an education, have their own careers, marry who they want, I am very confident that these young Indian girls will not choice to kill themselves. The young American girls will also see something they like about the cultural in India and adopt that.
The world has changed dramatically since I was growing up in the 1940’s and 50’s. South Africa still had apartheid. I don’t see how anyone can stop the world from changing. I think this is a very good thing.
tam // April 29, 2008 at 5:59 pm
“we often say that one of the hardest things in ministry is that we often want change for people more than they want it for themselves. and then nothing happens. nothing CAN happen until people want it and choose it.”
Exactly. that’s the problem.
It would probably offend them if we suggested their practices were wrong and inhumane. Take their religion out of it. take culture out of it. And it simply becomes cruelty, torture and murder. It baffles me. I have nothing by way of words or wisdom to offer here. Just prayer.
Mandy, you’re not being too philosophical at all. those are great questions and thoughts.
So how do you think the God of the bible look upon that? That culture? The innocent and brainwashed?
mandythompson // April 29, 2008 at 6:27 pm
alece: let me help you get that blanket off -> i think one reason people don’t change is because they don’t have hope. and they don’t have hope because they have no reason to hope.
i know a LOT LOT LOT of people who live life in misery because “that’s just the way things are” - the internal starvation of the soul can be just as devastating in America as physical starvation in other countries. see?
BUT, it is possible for people to hope for change when they realize that change is possible. so. we show them an “alternative lifestyle” (for lack of a better term).
we model an alternative from what they have been “conditioned” to believe. and we show them a better way.
slowly, but surely, those wanting and needing answers will get it. and then they will take it to the rest.
Tam: Jesus looked at the brainwashed woman at the well & told her her sins were forgiven - to go & sin no more. he re-washed her brain. and she went back & told everyone about it.
so did the legion-possessed man at the tombs.
so did the paralytic outside the Gate Beautiful in Acts 3.
Rahab the prostitute, etc etc etc
hopeless people. offered an alternative. they wanted it. so they received. and then offered that hope to others as well.
alece // April 29, 2008 at 6:49 pm
yes. show them something worth wanting.
mandythompson // April 29, 2008 at 7:22 pm
blanket gone?
tam // April 29, 2008 at 7:43 pm
Exactly!
So…how do others get inside and show them Hope?
I know God is quick to forgive and heal - but they need to see that as a possibility. But how?
mandythompson // April 29, 2008 at 8:21 pm
that’s the part that gets me. how? yeah. how??
for impoverished people? maybe showing them hope by educating them. teaching them skills. training them. offering them ways to help themselves and their families.
maybe?
….. maybe?
Amy // April 29, 2008 at 9:34 pm
So it sounds cliche… but I don’t mean it that way… this is a battle we must fight on our knees. We must view our prayers for socially unjust situations such as this as true warfare… it is active, it is powerful… it combats the true enemy and evil forces at work that drive this genocide.
As much as just the quote made my stomach turn- I think I need to read this book.
mandythompson // April 29, 2008 at 9:38 pm
Amy: prayer. good word… let me know what you think of the book if you read it.
TheNorEaster // April 29, 2008 at 10:40 pm
“how can we offer an alternative to people who might not even want a change? what do we do when people don’t want to be different/better/improved?”
The first question I got an answer for tonight at The Church of Misfits (modeled after Yanonelli’s [edit: Yaconelli's] “Notorious Sinners”). There is someone in that Bible Study group who was going to The Misfits on Tuesday nights, but he had stopped going to church. I decided to be patient, and eventually–CASUALLLY–asked if he would like to go to my church.
“You don’t have to,” I said. “But I think you might like it. The pastor has a great sense of humor and the music is awesome. You should stop by when you get a chance.”
And, over the months, that kind of became my refrain (though it was hardly a constant refrain). I would only mention it when the subject happened to come up because I don’t like pressuring people into making decisions that they are not ready to make, which only leaves them spiritually unprepared and, sadly, when that happens the seed doesn’t have fertile soil to prosper.
But, tonight, at The Church of Misfits, we were talking about the “signs and wonders” in our own lives, the things God had done for us that we think are extraordinairy. He said…
1. “I’m still alive.”
2. “TheNorEaster and I are really good friends because he gives a shit about me when no one else does. Like giving me a ride to the food bank or buying me groceries so that I don’t starve.”
3. “I’m going to church again.”
Yep. He’s going to church again. And he enjoyed the service this Sunday more than I did. (Been kind of down lately.) But…I waited. I had faith. I trusted God enough–sometimes faithfully, sometimes desperately–to bring that man to a point where he would realize that he needed more than just The Misfits, a simple Tuesday night Bible study for people who…Well, for people who don’t really fit in.
God does not see things from our perspective. And we certainly do not see things from His perspective. When we see atrocities like the ones Mandy mentioned in her post, we want it to stop and we want it stop NOW! And it would, of course, be great if it could end tonight. But God has more patience with humanity than humanity will ever have with humanity. Change takes time. Patience. And an enduring faith.
For if God had not been so paitent with us in our growth, we would scarcely be where we are today–eating solid spiritual food instead of drinking an infant’s spiritual milk. In the same way, we must be patient with the rest of humanity. And we must have faith that, in time, God will bring them to a point where they have had enough.
“The big results are not in your hands or mine. But they suddenly happen. And we can share in them; but there is not point in building our lives on this personal satisfaction [of results], which may be denied us and which, after all, is not that important.” -Jim Wallis
TheNorEaster // April 29, 2008 at 10:43 pm
Actually, I guess that pretty much answers the second question, too.
TheNorEaster // April 29, 2008 at 10:44 pm
Oop. That was supposed to be Yaconelli. I think. I’m bad with names. But he’s the guy who wrote “Messy Spirituality: God’s Annoying Love For Imperfect People.” You get the idea.
Michelle // April 29, 2008 at 11:47 pm
Good words, NorEaster. If we are all doing something…
I know we must pray, He is the One who is powerful and can move, His purposes will come to pass. That is not at all to say we just sit back and wait. We reach who we can where we are and we support the ministries that are doing it well. If your own church is not giving a large portion of their budget to quality missions, reaching those in need, then put your money into ministries where the work is being done. Give a portion to the church, but give, give, give to solid proven ministries:
Gospel for Asia - KP Yohanan - Sponsoring indigenous pastors spreading the Word.
World Vision - Sponsor children or buy supplies for the needy around the world with the Gospel given.
Missionaries - Alece - any you know who are doing good work.
Sponsor mission trips where people actually go to work and not to play.
I know there are many other good ministries out there - and if our local churches are not being responsible with the money they receive - then give elsewhere - we really don’t need large, posh churches. To whom much is given, much is required…we are the richest people in the world, I think God blessed us for reasons other than self-consumption.
I’m off my soapbox now - I’m feeling a bit convicted.
alece // April 30, 2008 at 12:59 am
blanket gone.
inWorship // April 30, 2008 at 2:28 am
Sounds like you and I had similar thoughts today.
these kinds of senseless acts are horrid! Unfortunately, this is what “religion” often does. I am so grateful the God sent Jesus on my behalf that I can be truly free and not live under some unattainable law.
What can we do? Continue to show them Jesus, because what if they truly see who Jesus is, they will see that these awful acts have no place on God’s plan.
lovewillbringustogether // April 30, 2008 at 5:42 am
“Lord, Grant me the serenity to accept the things i cannot change…
Grant me the Courage to change those things i am able to positively change…
But most especially Lord, Grant me your Wisdom to know the difference!”
Let me not, in attempting to help others from the infinite injustices that appear to my consciousness, ever forget my Role is to ‘walk’ closer to thee.
Mandy, i do not deny there is much that appears grossly wrong in this world much we would have differently , if we could but wish it so.
I am aware that anyone is capable of achieving great things from the most humblest of beginnings and that in Him All things are indeed possible.
Having said that - i am also a GREAT believer that Charity begins at home - wherever we make it.
Is America yet ‘perfect’ - does justice prevail for all - is murder, ritual or otherwise, removed from your own society/country? Does no child ever want for food in the US? Are there not the abused and the Fatherless and Widowed where you are? Does Love live in every American’s Heart?
There remains much to be done - a lot of it is much closer to ‘Home’ than India.
America may indeed be Richer than most countries - i don’t see it ever being much ‘better’. It does have a higher standard of hygene (mostly) But I am concerened for the Moral Direction of Leadership in the US today.
By all means share your Country’s excessive wealth (the ONE thing i can appreciate in Bill Gates!)
Share your Personal Hope to those willing to receive it…
But i think your Charity work is much needed in your own Home.
As your own country removes from it the many inequities it currently possesses Then it may better affect other nations to their aid own failings.
It is the height of Hypocrisy to wag a finger and say “let me show you how to live better” when you live in a place full of its own inequities.
While some of us live in a ‘Global Village’ these days, i believe our most pressing problems, the ones requuiring our most Urgent attentions, are the ones closest to us (and even within us).
<B
mandythompson // April 30, 2008 at 6:30 am
TheNor: if God had not been so patient - WHAT Truth. oh what truth…
Michelle (and Love) have both brought up a good point. i’m a firm believer in “backyard missions” - taking care of our own society.
“To whom much is given, much is required…we are the richest people in the world, I think God blessed us for reasons other than self-consumption.”
well said, michelle. i think - nay, HOPE - that if we can change OUR consumerist society to look beyond ourselves, we could more easily change the world.
this country is eaten up by materialism (an URGENT attention, as Love phrased it), and if OUR country would be healed of this disease the rest of the world would be effected as well.
THAT is a soapbox of mine. and i’m trying not to get started…
too bad its almost time for Whatever Wednesday - because i’m really enjoying this serious discussion right here.
i didn’t know y’all had “serious” in ya!
TheNorEaster // April 30, 2008 at 7:50 am
“’To whom much is given, much is required…we are the richest people in the world, I think God blessed us for reasons other than self-consumption.’
“well said, michelle. i think - nay, HOPE - that if we can change OUR consumerist society to look beyond ourselves, we could more easily change the world.
“this country is eaten up by materialism (an URGENT attention, as Love phrased it), and if OUR country would be healed of this disease the rest of the world would be effected as well.”
And it is only when we learn to be content that we can forsake that URGENT attention. Try to think of this way…EVERY time you buy something you do NOT need, you are taking money away from those that truly do need it. It is not of charity that I speak. But responsibility.
For instance, I have two people who work for me. I pay them salaries that average $25 an hour.
Want to end poverty?
Get. A. Clue.
People pat Bill Gates on the back because he gives so much of his fortune away to charity, but, as much good as he has done–and he has certainly done a lot of good–But if he had been so generous from the beginning, how many lives could have been spared the diseases for which so many now need so much medication? How many wars could have been averted if people did not need to take up arms to kill for cash just to feed their own families? How many children would have lived if he had built manufacturing plants in the continent of Africa and paid those employees a decent wage?
Eight months. Eight months I walked to work when it was 18 degrees outside and snowing with the wind cutting or the rain beating me like bullets because I CHOSE to pay my employees a decent wage instead of buying a brand new car so that I could ride in luxury.
So don’t tell me it can’t be done.
Don’t. Just…don’t.
Don’t EVER tell me it can’t be done!
[Getting off soapbox.]
mandythompson // April 30, 2008 at 8:31 am
TheNor: great story. thank you for offering that.
materialism in america. yes. CAN & SHOULD be changed - and i cheer on EVERYONE who changes the culture of their own family/home/budget. but HOW can we change the culture as a whole? how can we turn this stupid selfish country around? how can we help people see that the “American Dream” is really a nightmare???????? how?
TheNorEaster // April 30, 2008 at 3:47 pm
Change starts with you. And me. And our brothers. And sisters.
But don’t worry about anyone else. Just…”DO unto others as you would have them do unto you.” And then you will “BE the change you want to see in the world.”
Genny // May 1, 2008 at 12:32 am
Thanks for stopping by my blog again. I just had to tell you that being a mom is THE most rewarding and miraculous (and, yes, sometimes intimidating) experience ever. I enjoyed checking out your blog, and your worship blog too. Great job!
Genny
gchyayles // May 1, 2008 at 3:07 pm
This issue is very close to me. I am from Pakistan and while I spent majority of my years in England, the oppressive nature of Pakistani-Muslim culture has always been a hard reality to swallow. I have always been an advocate for human rights and it all makes so much sense now as to why it was so easy for me to fall in love with Jesus and be saved–the Muslim faith/traditions were not fair or just in my eyes and I constantly struggled with them as a young girl growing up surrounded by the biases and unjust rules of the society.
I worked in Domestic Violence for 4 years and my passion for that issue came from how much violence against women exists in Pakistan and even in my own extended family. The law in Pakistan is based on Islam and so there are very little options for women who are being abused. If a woman is raped, her case will only hold up in court if there were 3 or more witnesses otherwise she is the one sentenced for illicit sexual behavior [which is against the religion]. If a women is being physically abused and demands divorce, she will lose the rights to her children if she chooses to remarry or has any relations with another man. In villages, when families are battling against each other, the punishment for one family by another is to publicly gang rape on of the daughters or wives or mothers.
I don’t have a lot of answers except prayer and being missionaries to these countries and its people. I continue to pray for revelation from God as to what my role is in going back and helping the people who are suffering. At this point, due to my conversion, it hasn’t been safe for me to return to my country but it is my desire to help “set the captives free.” When and how that happens is not for me to know but in the meantime I pray that God would open the hearts and minds of these nations to recognize and acknowledge Him for who He is and to seek help from Him during these times of suffering.
mandythompson // May 1, 2008 at 3:10 pm
gchyayles: i thought about this post when i checked out your blog. thought about whether or not you’d read it - and what your response would be. really… wow. thank you for sharing both on a personal level and a level that we can all relate to. wow. really. i’m humbled that you’d come back to this silly little blog.
back to that “changing the world” conversation « just a girl // May 6, 2008 at 2:00 pm
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